First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page ... e&id=52440

The change doesn't really affect me as I always buy my books on the web site and download to my ipad. And I like that the comic companies and Comixology will not have to share with Apple. What I don't like is how they suddenly out of blue dump this change on us.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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good...i never understood how apple took 30 cents on the dollar anyway...i have a galaxy tab2 but samsung never got 30% off the top...bet the apple folks are livid though
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote:good...i never understood how apple took 30 cents on the dollar anyway...i have a galaxy tab2 but samsung never got 30% off the top...bet the apple folks are livid though
Reading the comments on comixology's Facebook page the app users are losing their minds. I agree they handled the change very poorly. Especially when you consider comic fans are not always good with change. That being said at the end of the day I don't find it that bad. Bookmark the main website on your tablet. Can still surf and shop. Just an extra step to download. Not that big of a deal. Still Comixology did a poor job of rolling this out.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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What a bad way to start the Amazon ownership of Comixology off on the wrong foot.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote:good...i never understood how apple took 30 cents on the dollar anyway...i have a galaxy tab2 but samsung never got 30% off the top...bet the apple folks are livid though
My samsung phone just got updated. Looks like you can still purchase books through their app. It just doesn't got through google and/or google play. Goes to whatever payment method you already have set up with the main website. In other words you can't use and money you have in your google play account.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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Here is Gerry Conway's take on this situation

Gerry Conway: The comiXology Outrage

Personally I tend to agree fully with Mr. Conway's comments. This is a battle between two platforms and two company's not in the comics business. The ultimate loser will be consumers and the comics industry. We are back to the distributor wars, just digitally this time, and we all know how well that turned out for comics.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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fudd71 wrote:Here is Gerry Conway's take on this situation

Gerry Conway: The comiXology Outrage

Personally I tend to agree fully with Mr. Conway's comments. This is a battle between two platforms and two company's not in the comics business. The ultimate loser will be consumers and the comics industry. We are back to the distributor wars, just digitally this time, and we all know how well that turned out for comics.
not an apple guy so it makes no difference to my digital buying experience,
but it sure sounds like conway and the ios crowd just doesnt want their experience diminished at the experience of another platform...well then apple should not have predatory skimming practices, they did nothing to earn 30% of a comic purchase ZERO and have been stealing it ever since, maybe we'll see a little more $ in the creator's pockets now

and digital is not this seemless impulse buy at the checkout counter - has conway ever redeemed those stupid marvel codes, takes forever and a bunch of hoops and then half the time the interface says its been redeemed when you just peeled the label off, why we cant have a scannable code in the smartphone age i will never know
JohnMayo wrote:What a bad way to start the Amazon ownership of Comixology off on the wrong foot.
i still contend Amazon is better for comics moving them from a niche more into the mainstream...
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote:not an apple guy so it makes no difference to my digital buying experience
I'm not an Apple user so it doesn't impact my personal experience either.
drew102e wrote:and digital is not this seemless impulse buy at the checkout counter - has conway ever redeemed those stupid marvel codes, takes forever and a bunch of hoops and then half the time the interface says its been redeemed when you just peeled the label off, why we cant have a scannable code in the smartphone age i will never know
I've redeemed tons of the code and have only had a problem a handful of times. The QR code is not a horrible idea but the 12 character code works fine and doesn't require a smartphone.
drew102e wrote:
JohnMayo wrote:What a bad way to start the Amazon ownership of Comixology off on the wrong foot.
i still contend Amazon is better for comics moving them from a niche more into the mainstream...
True, moving comics more into the mainstream is good. It is just a shame that the first impression Amazon made with Comixology users was a negative one.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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JohnMayo wrote: True, moving comics more into the mainstream is good. It is just a shame that the first impression Amazon made with Comixology users was a negative one.
I haven't heard many non-ios users complaining yet but it's still early...does google takes the same percentage from android device in-app purchases?

...wonder how publishers like monkeybrain and its 99 cent comics make any money at all after everyone gets their cut
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote:does google takes the same percentage from android device in-app purchases?


I don't think so but I don't know for certain.
drew102e wrote:...wonder how publishers like monkeybrain and its 99 cent comics make any money at all after everyone gets their cut
Great question. I'd love to know that too.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote: I haven't heard many non-ios users complaining yet but it's still early
Well certainly non-iOS users wouldn't complain, in the same round of updates that took the in-app purchases away from the iOS app it made in-app purchasing easier (more like the old iOS version) on Android devices.
drew102e wrote: ...does google takes the same percentage from android device in-app purchases?
Yes they do. If you are interested here is the transaction fee page of the Android developers support page.
drew102e wrote:...wonder how publishers like monkeybrain and its 99 cent comics make any money at all after everyone gets their cut
It is still cheaper to give an app store 30% of a sale then to give a reseller 50% and pay to print and ship a hard copy.


I happen to "use" (see below for why I put that in quotes) both the iOS and the Android Comixology app. I own and use an iPhone as well as an Android tablet. I downloaded the iPhone app just to check it out once. I played around decided I didn't like reading on the phone and deleted it. Personally I find reading on a phone size screen ridiculous. I don't read very many digital comics but when I do I read them on my Android tablet. I never purchase in-app, I am loyal to my LCS so I purchase any digital comics threw my LCS' Comixology web store front and then download and read on my tablet. The reason I bring all this up is as a registered user of both versions of the app I received two emails on Saturday. The one about the iOS app simply said we have a new app, you must download it, the old app is retired, here are the steps get your already purchased books on the new app, and start shopping on comixology.com. The one about the Android app simply encouraged you to download the new app (didn't say you had too, or they were retiring the old app, like the iOS one) because, and I quote directly from the email "In this new version, we have a new ComiXology in-app purchase system and a great new cart feature, one of the most request features."

This to me is the hight of hypocrisy. You can't send an email to iOS users telling them the new app is great, and not mention you took away in-app purchases and send an email to Android users at the same moment touting the great new in-app purchasing feature of the Android app, the same feature you just removed from the iOS app that is also "new and improved".

As I have stated this has zero affect on me, the limited number of digital comics I personally buy will still be bought threw my LCS' Comixology storefront on the web. However I realize my habits and a few friends habits don't make of the majority of digital sales. Here are some facts however that aren't biases by ones personal experience.

Between 6-7% of retail dollars are spent online

iOS purchases make up 23% of online sales, android users make up less than 5%

This isn't about creators making more, Google charges the same 30% as Apple. This is about Amazon hoping to get more people buying threw their device then buying threw Apple's devices. It may help Android and Kindle fire sales, my guess is it won't. The more likely outcome is people will keep their preferred device, and if that is an iOS device they will simply by forms of entertainment other than comics. While the numbers show as a percentage of market share Android has gained or past iOS the dollars those users spend keeps being more lop-side to iOS users.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote: ...does google takes the same percentage from android device in-app purchases?
fudd71 wrote:Yes they do. If you are interested here is the transaction fee page of the Android developers support page.
I find this to be highway robbery, it should be closer to 10% max, and not all in app purchases work this way though - i have an ebay app on my iphone, when i sell an item, i pay ebay & paypal their cut (don't get me started on this double dipping BS) BUT that's it, the rest is mine, Apple/Google get nada...whats the difference?
drew102e wrote:...wonder how publishers like monkeybrain and its 99 cent comics make any money at all after everyone gets their cut
fudd21 wrote:It is still cheaper to give an app store 30% of a sale then to give a reseller 50% and pay to print and ship a hard copy.
But you still paid comixology IN ADDITION to Apple so it was 30% to Apple and 30% to Comixology and 40% leftover for writer, artist, colorist, letterer, etc...right?
This to me is the height of hypocrisy. You can't send an email to iOS users telling them the new app is great, and not mention you took away in-app purchases and send an email to Android users at the same moment touting the great new in-app purchasing feature of the Android app, the same feature you just removed from the iOS app that is also "new and improved".
no that's just marketing, our beloved comics industry does it every month with "character 'A' will never be the same" & "this changes the 'B' universe forever"
i'm guessing itunes sales has this skewed a bit, must be lot of ios users shopping at amazon...it's really too bad we don't have comics specific data...or any digital comics sales data for that matter

and to echo your sentiment - i don't get reading comics on a phone, it isnt that enjoyable, i'll stick to a tablet
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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drew102e wrote:not all in app purchases work this way though - i have an ebay app on my iphone, when i sell an item, i pay ebay & paypal their cut (don't get me started on this double dipping BS) BUT that's it, the rest is mine, Apple/Google get nada...whats the difference?
This gets fairly technical on the different between these two types of transactions but I will try to make this simple and explain.

Making a purchase from eBay, Amazon (non MP3 or Amazon streaming video) or any other non-digital retail site with their app is not an in-app purchase. Theses apps simply allow communication between the merchant and the buyer. Apple or Google gets nothing in this type of transaction. Example: I order a bicycle from the Amazon app, they ship me a bicycle, transaction finished. The hardware and operating system of the device is nothing more then a way for me to tell Amazon I would like to purchase a bicycle and provide my payment information it is not necessary for the use of the bicycle in the future.

In-app purchases where Apple or Google does get a cut is where the item being purchases is for use with the hardware device and the devices operating system is necessary for the use of the purchase. Providing that operating system makes the product usable and that is why Apple or Google feel they deserve a cut. If it wasn't for their device or operating system the product wouldn't function or exist is their argument. Example: I buy a new level of Angry Birds on my device, the way I use that product is playing the app on the device using the device's hardware and operating system. Without the device I can't use the purchase.

Now the area of contention, the items that aren't fully one or the other like digital comics (digital music, movies and ebooks are in this category too). So if you buy an item like this it is assumed you are buying for use on the device you bought it from, therefore the operating systems owner wants a cut (essentially a licensing fee for the technology to use the digital file). The counter argument would be you bought the file from the app but plan on using somewhere else (on the web, on a different device/player whatever), this mostly isn't true and everyone knows it. While it is possible it isn't likely.

Apple and Amazon have a long standing feud in this arena. If you look at the Amazon app on an iOS device you can browse all products, but digital items like instant videos, MP3s and Kindle books can only be added to your wish-list not actually purchased through the app. These items have to be purchased through the website not the app. There are also separate Amazon Cloud (MP3 music), Amazon Instant Video (movies and television) and Kindle (ebook) apps to use the digital items after purchases from the website on an iOS device. Comics from Comixology are now in this same class. To be fair Apple is more generous (fair) in this regard then Amazon. Apple does at least allow Amazon to have player apps on Apple devices. Amazon does not reciprocate, you can't watch iTunes videos, stream your iTunes music or read your iBooks purchases on any Amazon device (Kindle, Kindle fire or Amazon TV).

If you think creators will get more because of this change, I think you are wrong. My guess is Comixology gets between 45-75% of the purchase price of comic and they simply don't want to share that with Apple. The chances of creators/publishers getting much back (maybe a few points, but nowhere near 30%) is very slim. If Comixology was to state that they will give creators back the 30% that use to go to Apple there would be little to no complaining about this, it would be be great PR for Comixology. But they haven't said that because they have no intention of giving to the creators, they just want to pocket it all.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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fudd71 wrote:If you think creators will get more because of this change, I think you are wrong. My guess is Comixology gets between 45-75% of the purchase price of comic and they simply don't want to share that with Apple. The chances of creators/publishers getting much back (maybe a few points, but nowhere near 30%) is very slim. If Comixology was to state that they will give creators back the 30% that use to go to Apple there would be little to no complaining about this, it would be be great PR for Comixology. But they haven't said that because they have no intention of giving to the creators, they just want to pocket it all.
Very interesting point. That would have been a great way for Comixology/Amazon to have handled the issue. Even if they didn't give the full 30% of it to the creators, giving some or most of it to them would have cast the issue in a very different light.
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Re: First Sign of Amazon's influence on Comixology

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fudd71 wrote:
drew102e wrote:not all in app purchases work this way though - i have an ebay app on my iphone, when i sell an item, i pay ebay & paypal their cut (don't get me started on this double dipping BS) BUT that's it, the rest is mine, Apple/Google get nada...whats the difference?
Making a purchase from eBay, Amazon (non MP3 or Amazon streaming video) or any other non-digital retail site with their app is not an in-app purchase. Theses apps simply allow communication between the merchant and the buyer. Apple or Google gets nothing in this type of transaction. Example: I order a bicycle from the Amazon app, they ship me a bicycle, transaction finished. The hardware and operating system of the device is nothing more then a way for me to tell Amazon I would like to purchase a bicycle and provide my payment information it is not necessary for the use of the bicycle in the future.


nor is it with a comic, there are lots of ways to buy a digital comic, panelsyndicate, monkeybrain, thrillbent, image, dc, marvel will all sell you a comic, some even DRM free,

there are also lots of ways to read a digital comic and you don't need the comixology app, plenty of cbr readers out there. now i agree comixology does it better, like itunes does a better job with music than other players, but i can buy music anywhere and import into itunes, again no cut for them...

so i see this evolving into something much more consumer friendly, no more beta vs vhs wars necessary
fudd21 wrote:My guess is Comixology gets between 45-75% of the purchase price of comic and they simply don't want to share that with Apple.
no way is it that high, when i buy a book for my kindle amazon gets a piece off the top, the rest goes to publisher/author, even if i read it on my ipad with the kindle app, apple doesnt get squat and isnt that amazing it works like a charm, that's the model we should look to and it works just fine.
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